Comments on: Why I Don't Run Windows, 6 https://pthree.org/2007/06/05/why-i-dont-run-windows-6/ Linux. GNU. Freedom. Mon, 09 Oct 2017 10:42:05 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=4.9-alpha-41547 By: Michael Hoskins https://pthree.org/2007/06/05/why-i-dont-run-windows-6/#comment-55893 Thu, 07 Jun 2007 20:25:14 +0000 http://www.pthree.org/2007/06/05/why-i-dont-run-windows-6/#comment-55893 @Maxo and Aaron: I do agree that it would likely not happen in the FOSS community, and that Microsoft licenses are draconian in scope ("Thou shalt not work around technical limitations in this software" and the like). What I disagreed with was the idea that Jamie did not intentionally violate the EULA, since it seemed pretty clear from those articles that he fully understood what he was doing.

I have since read Jamie's blog posts on the subject, and can see that those articles summations of the events don't really tell the whole story. Jamie's posts on the matter clearly show he searched the EULA as well as he could (not being a lawyer). Vague catchall clauses FTW.

@Aaron: You have every right to believe whatever you want. I wasn't trying to suggest otherwise. I apologize if I came off as hostile.

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By: bono https://pthree.org/2007/06/05/why-i-dont-run-windows-6/#comment-55711 Wed, 06 Jun 2007 21:34:19 +0000 http://www.pthree.org/2007/06/05/why-i-dont-run-windows-6/#comment-55711 9. SCOPE OF LICENSE. The software is licensed, not sold. This agreement only gives you some rights to use the software. Microsoft reserves all other rights. Unless applicable law gives you more rights despite this limitation, you may use the software only as expressly permitted in this agreement. In doing so, you must comply with any technical limitations in the software that only allow you to use it in certain ways. For more information, see http://www.microsoft.com/licensing/userights. You may not
• work around any technical limitations in the software;

And then:
http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/vstudio/aa700921.aspx

As you can see, those features have been on purpose disabled on the express edition, making it technical limitation.

What that Cansdale did is pretty obvious. He didn't read or care to understand the EULA, just the same broke it. Carelessness is not a pretty good excuse.

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By: Aaron https://pthree.org/2007/06/05/why-i-dont-run-windows-6/#comment-55702 Wed, 06 Jun 2007 20:30:31 +0000 http://www.pthree.org/2007/06/05/why-i-dont-run-windows-6/#comment-55702 @bono- I agree on the grounds that large corporations make mistakes in decisions. This is common when communication is corrupted between departments. And, my reasoning for not using Windows is due to the nature of Microsoft's actions to this developer. As it has been made readily apparent, Jason did not intentionally violate the EULA, but rather used open APIs, and Microsoft has yet to point out specifically where Jason made the error.

@Jason- Yes. Iceweasel exists, because Mozilla will not make patches upstream, and will not release the trademark. AFAIK, however, Mozilla has never threatened a legal course of action to Debian, or other Linux distributions that distribute Firefox binaries without the branding.

@Michael- Again, I believe, as is my right, that Cansdale did not violate the EULA intentionally, if it was in fact violated. He used open APIs for the Express version that is published on Microsoft's site. And, yes, I read the other link. Microsoft feels they have a case under their belts. I guess only time will tell.

@Maxo- At least someone understands the point of my post. Thanks for taking the time to figure out what I'm saying in black and white. 🙂

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By: Maxo https://pthree.org/2007/06/05/why-i-dont-run-windows-6/#comment-55699 Wed, 06 Jun 2007 19:25:07 +0000 http://www.pthree.org/2007/06/05/why-i-dont-run-windows-6/#comment-55699 To Michael Hoskins
Setting aside whether or not Jason is in the right or the wrong, Aaron's point still stands that this would not happen in the FOSS community. In the FOSS community Jamie's code would probably find it's way in the official release.

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By: Michael Hoskins https://pthree.org/2007/06/05/why-i-dont-run-windows-6/#comment-55635 Wed, 06 Jun 2007 15:35:10 +0000 http://www.pthree.org/2007/06/05/why-i-dont-run-windows-6/#comment-55635 Setting aside the discussion of whether Microsoft is right to charge for their products, Jason clearly violated the EULA for the Visual Studio Express products. Violating terms of an agreement would be unacceptable for GPL, CC, or any other open source software.

If you had read the other link in the quote you provided, you would see that his software did, then did not, then did again violate the Express terms of service.

For the record, I do think that it's incredibly lame and stupid of Microsoft to not allow developers to extend the Express products, but the fact remains that they are freely available when Microsoft clearly is under no obligation to make them so. No, it's not fair, but such is often the case.

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By: Jason https://pthree.org/2007/06/05/why-i-dont-run-windows-6/#comment-55634 Wed, 06 Jun 2007 14:49:29 +0000 http://www.pthree.org/2007/06/05/why-i-dont-run-windows-6/#comment-55634 Only playing Devil's Advocate. I think you know by now just by seeing my UA/OS in my comments that I use Open Source Software as well (and greatly prefer it), however...

There's a reason why Iceweasel exists...

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By: bono https://pthree.org/2007/06/05/why-i-dont-run-windows-6/#comment-55612 Wed, 06 Jun 2007 11:06:11 +0000 http://www.pthree.org/2007/06/05/why-i-dont-run-windows-6/#comment-55612 Most of the big corporations have disconnections that lead into some middle level manager or such doing very silly decisions on his own. This is just a case of normal corporate idiocy and starts happening as the companies grow unless if the management is expectionally good and understands how to work with the corporate culture, communication of goals, and management grip. You can now take off your tin foil hat.

Besides, I can't really see any solid logic in behind deriving "don't use Windows" from issue concerning the EULA and licensing issues of the Visual Studio family. Visual Studio is just one text editor for specialized task for the use of code monkeys, and can be made for instance to run on Linux (if you really REALLY want to).

The US law has in the copyright law too the improper addition clauses and uhh if they want to invoke some stuff like that it's their right. It might even screw up them as well, so it's an obvious mistake even from their point of view as they lose the tool that they found useful for them as well.. But that's still their right.

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